Our first guest tonight might be the most famous person in the country. She is an author, a podcast host, and the former First Lady of the United States. Her latest number-one bestselling book is titled The Look. Please welcome Michelle Obama.
How are you? Thank you not only for being here but also for attending the Nelson family’s Christmas party. What a wonderful, picture-perfect family. They are a military family, right? Veterans, yes. We must remember to thank them for their service. It was a wonderful family, and I was so happy to be a part of it.
I’m glad you were part of it too. How many Christmas cards does the Obama family send out? You know, we checked—it’s over 100,000. It includes some of our closest friends and family, but also business associates and people from various foundations. There are many people we want to thank. I’m not even sure if we have to pay for the postage!
Do you exchange gifts within the family? I do. Everyone receives gifts. I am usually the one who organizes it because our daughters don’t have their own money yet. We tell them, “Don’t take our money just to buy us gifts; we know it’s technically ours anyway.” My kids are the same; they don’t do anything but still want the credit. It’s a bad message, isn’t it?
But we do exchange gifts because Christmas is very important to us. I am a huge Christmas person. On Christmas morning, we wake up, have a late brunch, invite friends over, read Santa’s letter, and open presents. My sister-in-law’s ex-husband actually writes the Santa letters. He’s my ex-brother-in-law, but he still writes them every year.
Does your husband give you good gifts? Does he have an advisor? Yes, he consults with Meredith Koop, my stylist. He tried hard during the first few years of our marriage. I would open a gift and think, “Well, he certainly tried.” I’ve never returned a gift, but there are times I think he’ll never see me wear it again. I don’t return them because of the sentimental value and the effort he put into it.
Is it appropriate to give your own book as a Christmas gift? I don’t really do that. I only send it to close friends and family when it first comes out; I don’t try to cheat by giving it as a holiday gift later.
Looking back at your time in the White House, how many Christmas parties did you attend in December? It was weeks of holiday parties, sometimes two or three a day. The biggest ones would end in the evening with thousands of people. We would stand in the receiving line and take photos for three hours at a time, every day for weeks. It was like being a mall Santa. I often felt bad for the guests; they should have been upstairs dancing and drinking, but instead, they were stuck in line waiting to meet us. It felt a bit unfair.
When was the last time you went to a mall? It’s been a long time since I was in a mall, but I did go into a store recently. Over the last ten years, I’ve actually been to many public places without being recognized. I fly commercial sometimes, and I drive myself now. We realized that people don’t usually notice me; they notice the Secret Service first. Usually, a big guy tells someone to “wait” or “stop,” and then people look up, realize who I am, and wonder why he’s touching them. Our team learned that if everyone just stays quiet, I can blend in. If I wear a hat and some Lululemon gear, I look like any other woman. These days, nobody is looking at anyone anyway; everyone is staring at their phones.
I’m curious about your driving. When did you start driving again? The summer before last. I’m only allowed to drive on Martha’s Vineyard since it’s a small island with no highways. They still monitor me with a car in front and one behind, so it feels a bit like Disneyland, but I am alone in the car. I can roll the windows down, which I could never do in the official cars because it was considered dangerous.
Recently, Malia and I were in the car together—just the two of us—and she was playing the radio. It was a beautiful moment. She had seen me drive before we became “us,” back when she was very young. Driving is like riding a bike; I’m pretty good at it. Everyone was a bit nervous at first, wondering if I still knew what I was doing. Car technology has changed so much—there are no keys now. It takes me a second to figure out how to work the music, but Barack has driven a couple of times too. We get excited about it. It sounds crazy, but some of our best days are spent just driving alone in the car.
You do a podcast with your brother, Craig. He seems like a great guy. We have so much fun. I probably wouldn’t do it if it weren’t with him because I like working in a community. When the idea was suggested, I thought talking to people by myself sounded lonely. Our producer suggested Craig because everybody loves him. It felt like a way to honor our mother, especially since we lost her recently. It forces us to see each other on a regular basis for work, and his kids even come to the tapings.
You also had the comedian Katt Williams on. His life story is incredible—he left home at twelve years old. While he was talking, I told him, “Katt, if you’re lying to me, I’m the former First Lady and I’m going to be really mad.” But he is genuinely funny, and his perspective is unique. That’s what I love about the podcast; we have hours to let people unwind until they stop thinking about who I am and we just get into a great conversation.
I also want to mention Rob and Michele Reiner. I know you and your husband were friends with them, and I’m sorry for your loss. We have known them for many years. We were actually supposed to see them the night we got the news. Unlike what some might say, Rob and Michele are some of the most decent, courageous people you could know. They were passionate and showed real courage during a time when it was lacking. They put action behind their beliefs regarding family, the country, and equity.
I heard some girls in the audience getting excited earlier—don’t worry, I’m here to talk to everyone! People really love Barack. My daughters and I make fun of him every chance we get. Poor guy, he has to go out into the world to build his confidence back up because when he comes home, we’re just like, “Oh, what is that you’re wearing?”
Regarding your book, is it strange that people are so interested in your clothes? Not really. Throughout history, people have been interested in the style of First Ladies. Only a handful of people have served in that role, so there is a curiosity about what goes on behind the scenes. We aren’t celebrities, but there is an “otherness” to the position. In any presidential library, the most popular exhibit is usually the First Lady’s inaugural gown.
I’ve saved the clothing that had a significant impact. Those pieces are donated to the White House Historical Association to be archived. The Obama Presidential Center will open in June and will feature many of the fashions I wore, and maybe even Barack’s famous tan suit or his “mom jeans.”
The book is a collection of photos, but I wanted them to feel alive. It’s not just me in a dress; it’s about what I was doing in those dresses and the story behind them. It explores what it takes for women to show up in the world and what that says about our culture and self-esteem. Women are often judged first by how they look, and when people want to make a woman feel small, they often attack her appearance. I wanted to talk about how we take control of that and turn it into power.
There’s also a story about the first time I met Oprah. It was a typical Oprah gesture. Before we were well-known, she wanted to feature Barack in O Magazine. She showed up at our house with a camera crew. I was running around with the kids and my job, so I just threw on some capris and a sweater. I didn’t even have my makeup done because I didn’t realize I needed it.
As a thank you, Oprah sent a steamer trunk full of Ralph Lauren clothes. I felt like the people on her show—I was so excited! But when Barack came home, he said we couldn’t keep them because he was in office and there are laws against accepting gifts. However, there’s a happy ending: after his state senate term ended and before he joined the U.S. Senate, there was a window where he wasn’t in office, and Oprah sent the clothes back. You really can’t beat Oprah.
Since the book is about fashion, I’d love to get your quick opinion on some trends. Cargo shorts? On a man, if they are the right size and paired with the right top, they can be cute—provided he’s clean! Crocs? I don’t like them on men. Tank tops on men? It depends on your “guns.” If you have them, go for it; if not, maybe wear a sleeve. Overalls? No. Men wearing shoes without socks? That’s not bad. Birkenstocks? I love them. They aren’t “your mama’s Birkenstocks” anymore; they have studs and fur now. They’re comfortable, and when you get older, you want comfort.
When I was a kid, I had a few style icons. One was Teresa Graves from the show Get Christie Love. She was a gorgeous, tough, and sexy police hero. I always wanted white go-go boots like hers, but my mother was practical and told me I couldn’t wear them in the Chicago snow. Instead, I got those ugly rubber boots that fit over your shoes.
My other icon was José Cardenal, the first baseman for the Chicago Cubs. I had a huge crush on him. Because I had a big brother, I was a bit of a tomboy and loved playing baseball. In the summers, I’d wear my hair in an afro and put on a cap like him. It was also tied to my relationship with my dad; he was a shift worker, and we’d watch the Cubs games together when he got home. I finally got to meet José during our last term when the Cubs won the World Series. I walked up to him and told him that story, and he cried. It was a beautiful, full-circle moment.
The book is available now. Michelle Obama, everyone! Thank you so much.
